Sniper Shootings
Question:
> People like you created that "paranoia"
Nonsense (I don’t use the word BS like you do). Pure, unadulterated nonsense. Proof is that the paranoia in the Washington DC area is not created by anybody on this news group nor anybody for gun common sense. It is created by a person who is killing people randomly with, without doubt, an arm you’d justify anybody having. Earl
Response:
Earl quoted me: > People like you created that "paranoia"
and replied: >Nonsense (I don’t use the word BS like >you do). Pure, unadulterated >nonsense. >Proof is that the paranoia in the >Washington DC area is not created by >anybody on this news group nor anybody >for gun common sense. It is created >by a person who is killing people >randomly with, without doubt, an arm >you’d
justify anybody having. Bullshit. Any "paranoia" is only created by a liberal-dominated "mainstream" media hyping a guy(s) who’s killed far fewer people in over a week than house fires kill <i>daily</i> in America – house fires that go unreported 30 miles away. These guys (consistently reported by witnesses as two in van or truck) have been hyped out of all context to "everyday" fatality risks in America – particularly when compared to things not almost entirely confined to a 15-mile radius of Washington. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->This part of America must be void of guns >in the hands of the public and is >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. > Anyone blaming the sniper on "gun availability" conveniently forgets that > all but one of his killings have been within 15 miles of Washington, most all > in gun-ban Washington or in very-antigun Maryland – and only one beyond that > radius in gun-laden Virginia. > Thought for day – this being National Fire Prevention Month: 12 die in home > fires daily in U.S., more than sniper has killed in a week. Think U.S. home > fire deaths are so ghettoized to one troubled 15-mile radius? > <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather > <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: > official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
That whole area is totally defenseless. The news media is totally mesmerized by this sniper while ignoring the people that were killed and injured in a massive pileup on the freeway in Wisconsin. What the hell, people killed in house fires and cars don’t serve count.
Response:
writes >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and is >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt.
What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. — Gordon
Response:
>What supreme logic! If it was devoid of >guns there would be no sniper.
Within the past 24 hours, a bomb killed over 170 people – most from antigun Australia – who were tourists on nearby Bali. Earlier this week, at least six were killed in a bombing in Finland that some Finn police now think was just a nut kid. And last 9/11, more Americans were mass-murdered in <I>one hour</i> than in all "mass shootings" combined. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
> writes >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and is >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. > What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. > — > Gordon
It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast majority in that area are defenseless.
Response:
writes > writes > >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and is > >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. > What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. > — > Gordon >It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast majority >in that area are defenseless.
Whatever weapons the victims possessed, they are just as dead. Even in a wartime situation, snipers can usually pick off a fair number before they are spotted and dealt with. Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed? — Gordon
Response:
>Whatever weapons the victims >possessed, they are just as dead.
What about Dr. Harold Shipman’s <I>hundreds</i> of victims he killed in decades of serial murder in gun-control Britain? Are they "alive" because Shipman didn’t shoot them with a gun? Right now, a nurse in Holland is on trial for another Shipman-like serial murder spree; 13 known dead. But they weren’t shot with guns – so they don’t count. >Even in a wartime situation, snipers can >usually pick off a fair number >before they are spotted and dealt with.
You know nothing about sniping. Sniper won’t fire more than two rounds from same place – in order to avoid being shot himself. Standard military sniper doctrine for decades. >Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed?
And how many of <I>them</i> have the Washington "snipesr" killed?? <a href="http://www.alamanceind.com/nation/nation_1.html">How skilled are Washington "snipers?" <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > writes >> writes >> >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and is >> >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. >> What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. >> — >> Gordon >It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast majority >in that area are defenseless. > Whatever weapons the victims possessed, they are just as dead. > Even in a wartime situation, snipers can usually pick off a fair number > before they are spotted and dealt with. > Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed? > — > Gordon
It’s going to take more than a few armed policeman.
Response:
writes – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> writes > >> writes > >> >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and >is > >> >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. > >> What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. > >> — > >> Gordon > >It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast >majority > >in that area are defenseless. > Whatever weapons the victims possessed, they are just as dead. > Even in a wartime situation, snipers can usually pick off a fair number > before they are spotted and dealt with. > Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed? >It’s going to take more than a few armed policeman.
But getting back to the subject of citizens carrying guns; after 9 fatal shootings, nobody seems to have got a decent sighting of this sniper chappie, so how the heck are they supposed to take a bead on him and make an accurate shot? — Gordon
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > writes >> writes >> >> writes >> >> >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and >is >> >> >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. >> >> What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. >> >> — >> >> Gordon >> >It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast >majority >> >in that area are defenseless. >> Whatever weapons the victims possessed, they are just as dead. >> Even in a wartime situation, snipers can usually pick off a fair number >> before they are spotted and dealt with. >> Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed? >It’s going to take more than a few armed policeman. > But getting back to the subject of citizens carrying guns; after 9 fatal > shootings, nobody seems to have got a decent sighting of this sniper > chappie, so how the heck are they supposed to take a bead on him and > make an accurate shot? > — > Gordon
England is in the same predicament as the DC area, unarmed citizens. How would you get him?
Response:
writes – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> writes > >> writes > >> >> writes > >> >> >This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public >and > >is > >> >> >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt. > >> >> What supreme logic! If it was devoid of guns there would be no sniper. > >> >> — > >> >> Gordon > >> >It’s a bit superior than yours because there is a sniper and the vast > >majority > >> >in that area are defenseless. > >> Whatever weapons the victims possessed, they are just as dead. > >> Even in a wartime situation, snipers can usually pick off a fair number > >> before they are spotted and dealt with. > >> Errm, aren’t all your policemen armed? > >It’s going to take more than a few armed policeman. > But getting back to the subject of citizens carrying guns; after 9 fatal > shootings, nobody seems to have got a decent sighting of this sniper > chappie, so how the heck are they supposed to take a bead on him and > make an accurate shot? > — > Gordon >England is in the same predicament as the DC area, unarmed citizens. How would >you >get him?
We don’t have him, or rather, we don’t have as many of him as you do. 
— Gordon
Response:
>This part of America must be void of guns >in the hands of the public and is >relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt.
Anyone blaming the sniper on "gun availability" conveniently forgets that all but one of his killings have been within 15 miles of Washington, most all in gun-ban Washington or in very-antigun Maryland – and only one beyond that radius in gun-laden Virginia. Thought for day – this being National Fire Prevention Month: 12 die in home fires daily in U.S., more than sniper has killed in a week. Think U.S. home fire deaths are so ghettoized to one troubled 15-mile radius? <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jim quoted me: >> If guns were treated legally like cars, >>every 16-year-old would have one. > and replied: >Huh? > Know any 16-year-old American who <I>isn’t</I> a driver? > Driving is so universal among all over 16 in America that mass transit has > totally failed to get any significant adult ridership outside of NYC and a few > "college towns" since WWII. Blue Nation or Red Nation, everywhere but NYC and > "college towns," anyone over 16 seems to drive – even if he’s poor, illiterate, > had many tickets. >>If guns were treated like cars, every >>habitual criminal would have them, >>even ones who habitually misused guns >>- just like the neighbor’s son who > had >>three DUIs by age 21. >Nonsense. Unliscenced drivers are >treated very harshly in most places.
They sure are. They one that ran a stop sign and clobbered my wife is being treated very harshly. No insurance, won’t pay, skipped town and the police said "sorry about that".. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Bull. Illegal aliens so routinely drive unlicensed that 1/5 of Kalifornia > drivers now do. >> Guns aren’t treated like cars for the >>best of reasons – one big one > being >>that car owners don’t distrust registering >>them as a slippery slope to >>confiscation also long demanded by >>anticar activists! >The paranoia of the gun nuts shines thru >every time. > People like you created that "paranoia" – with your endless talk of > confiscating guns. HCI did more to create such "paranoia" than the NRA could > have dreamed of. > Thought for the day – from National Fire Prevention Month: 12 people die in > U.S. <i>daily</i> in home fires. That’s four more than the D.C. sniper has > total in over a week. > <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather > <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: > official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
Jim quoted me: >If guns were treated like cars, every >>habitual criminal would have >them, even ones who habitually >>misused guns – just like the neighbor’s >son who had three DUIs by age 21.
quoted Jim: >>Nonsense. Unliscenced drivers are >>>treated very harshly in most places.
and replied (sarcastically): >They sure are. They one that ran a stop >sign and clobbered my wife is being >treated very harshly. No insurance, won’t >pay, skipped town and the police >said "sorry about that"..
You must have been hit by the uninsured driver who hit my mother and me about five years ago – then fled his second at-fault wreck in two days. State trooper basically said the hell with it. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
> If guns were treated legally like cars, every 16-year-old would have one.
Huh? >If guns were treated like cars, every habitual criminal would have them, even >ones who habitually misused guns – just like the neighbor’s son who had three >DUIs by age 21.
Nonsense. Unliscenced drivers are treated very harshly in most places. > Guns aren’t treated like cars for the best of reasons – one big one being >that car owners don’t distrust registering them as a slippery slope to >confiscation also long demanded by anticar activists!
The paranoia of the gun nuts shines thru every time.
Response:
Jim quoted me: > If guns were treated legally like cars, >>every 16-year-old would have one.
and replied: >Huh?
Know any 16-year-old American who <I>isn’t</I> a driver? Driving is so universal among all over 16 in America that mass transit has totally failed to get any significant adult ridership outside of NYC and a few "college towns" since WWII. Blue Nation or Red Nation, everywhere but NYC and "college towns," anyone over 16 seems to drive – even if he’s poor, illiterate, had many tickets. >If guns were treated like cars, every >>habitual criminal would have them, >even ones who habitually misused guns >>- just like the neighbor’s son who had >three DUIs by age 21. >Nonsense. Unliscenced drivers are >treated very harshly in most places.
Bull. Illegal aliens so routinely drive unlicensed that 1/5 of Kalifornia drivers now do. > Guns aren’t treated like cars for the >>best of reasons – one big one being >that car owners don’t distrust registering >>them as a slippery slope to >confiscation also long demanded by >>anticar activists! >The paranoia of the gun nuts shines thru >every time.
People like you created that "paranoia" – with your endless talk of confiscating guns. HCI did more to create such "paranoia" than the NRA could have dreamed of. Thought for the day – from National Fire Prevention Month: 12 people die in U.S. <i>daily</i> in home fires. That’s four more than the D.C. sniper has total in over a week. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
> > All guns SHOULD be registered and fingerprinted. And all gun owners should > be liscensed. > Just like we do with cars. > There was apparently an additional type of machine used in these crimes > – a while van or truck of some kind. While we’re at it, we better > register all the vehicles and license all the drivers, too… > John Cowart
This part of America must be void of guns in the hands of the public and is relatively safe for a sniper on the hunt.
Response:
John quoted me: > More Brady lies. Far more than one >>model .223 rifle is a bolt-action > varmint rifle.
and replied: >Actually, I don’t think the police have >stated that it was a bolt action.
Nor have they stated that it was from an "assault rifle" – just that either it or a hunting rifle was possible. >The police have probably succeeded in >getting a >count of the number of lands and grooves >and the twist rate from bullet >fragments, and narrowed it down to 4 >models from there.
I doubt that. Several bullets have been too mangled to compare. In any case, .223 ammo at that range disintegrates into about 24 pieces on entering a body – and each is tiny. >At least one bolt action (Winchester) has >the same 1-in-9 twist that is commonly >found in AR-15s.
I’d guess that almost all noncustom .223 rifles have that rate of twist – as they fire similar bullet weights at similar muzzle velocity. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
>All guns SHOULD be registered and >fingerprinted. And all gun owners should >be liscensed. >Just like we do with cars.
If guns were treated legally like cars, every 16-year-old would have one. If guns were treated like cars, every habitual criminal would have them, even ones who habitually misused guns – just like the neighbor’s son who had three DUIs by age 21. Want that? Guns aren’t treated like cars for the best of reasons – one big one being that car owners don’t distrust registering them as a slippery slope to confiscation also long demanded by anticar activists! <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
>>These limitations speak to a need for >a national ballistics fingerprinting law for >all firearms. > Just a backdoor argument for gun registration.
All guns SHOULD be registered and fingerprinted. And all gun owners should be liscensed. Just like we do with cars.
Response:
> More Brady lies. Far more than one model .223 rifle is a bolt-action > varmint rifle.
Actually, I don’t think the police have stated that it was a bolt action. There are certainly any number of AR-15 variations that are accurate enough to be the weapon in this case, and the flat-top models can be easily scoped. The police have probably succeeded in getting a count of the number of lands and grooves and the twist rate from bullet fragments, and narrowed it down to 4 models from there. At least one bolt action (Winchester) has the same 1-in-9 twist that is commonly found in AR-15s. I have no data for the number of lands and grooves. John Cowart
Response:
> All guns SHOULD be registered and fingerprinted. And all gun owners should > be liscensed. > Just like we do with cars.
There was apparently an additional type of machine used in these crimes – a while van or truck of some kind. While we’re at it, we better register all the vehicles and license all the drivers, too… John Cowart
Response:
Issue: 77 – Wednesday, October 09, 2002 Statement by Sarah Brady on the Sniper Shootings Today, Sarah Brady, Chair of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence united with the Million Mom March, issued the following statement about the sniper shootings in suburban Maryland and the greater Washington, D.C. area: "On behalf of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence united with the Million Mom March, I want to express our deepest sympathies to the families of the victims of these senseless shootings. Gun violence is always devastating to a community, but it is even more horrifying when such violence strikes for no conceivable reason other than to terrorize. "As police try to track down and stop this killer, we do know this: sensible gun laws can help law enforcement solve crimes as well as prevent gun violence. The unique markings, called the ‘ballistic fingerprint,’ that every gun leaves on a fired bullet or shell casing have always been helpful in investigating shootings. We have already seen the usefulness of ballistic tests in definitively linking six of the eight shootings to the same firearm. "We have also seen the limitations to ballistic fingerprinting laws in their current form. Only two states — Maryland and New York — require a record be kept of every new gun’s ballistic fingerprint. Both states’ laws are relatively new and apply only to handguns, not all long guns, which the weapon in this case almost surely is. These limitations speak to a need for a national ballistics fingerprinting law for all firearms. Doesn’t it make sense for us to give law enforcement the tools they need in order to solve such crimes? "Furthermore, according to police, the shooter could be using one of four possible firearms to carry out this shooting spree. Three of the four are assault rifles. It’s important to remember that the federal assault weapons ban <http://www.bradycampaign.org/facts/gunlaws/awb.asp> expires in September 2004. We do not want to put more military-style weapons capable of such devastation and worse back on our streets. "The National Rifle Association, which claims to be on the side of law enforcement, fought the assault weapons ban and it fights ballistic fingerprinting laws. Instead of supporting measures that would help police solve crimes and prevent gun violence, it promotes the dangerous notion that ‘an armed society is a polite society.’ Sadly, far too many Americans every year pay the consequences of the NRA’s ‘polite society’ with their lives."
Response:
Jim quoted Sarah Brady: > Gun violence is always >devastating to a community, but it is even >more horrifying when such >violence strikes for no conceivable reason >other than to terrorize.
What about "gun violence" spree killings now makes them any more "devastating" than were the Tylenol poisonings that killed almost exactly the same number of random victims in the Chicago area 20 years ago? What about "gun violence" spree killings now makes them any more "devastating" than the death of 300 times as many in "boxcutter violence" (or was that "airplane violence") in NYC last 9/1? Sarah Brady doesn’t give a damn about "violence" – just about guns! >These limitations speak to a need for >a national ballistics fingerprinting law for >all firearms.
Just a backdoor argument for gun registration. And – after we saw registration be just a slippery slope to confiscation in Britain, Canada, and Australia – do you think we’d comply with the estimated 250 million guns we already have? >"Furthermore, according to police, the >shooter could be using one of four >possible firearms to carry out this >shooting spree. Three of the four are >assault rifles.
More Brady lies. Far more than one model .223 rifle is a bolt-action varmint rifle. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
