Problem: Barnes bullets in .270 Win
Question:
# # I have yet to talk to a person who can get a Barnes bullet to group as # well as another bullet in their rifle/pistol! maybe the length compared # to density of lead/lead core. I have. The .338 I just sold off (boredom) would put 3 210 grain X boat tails into 0.3" at 100 yards using a max load of IMR 4350. The trick isn’t length; communication I had with an industry insider (barrel maker) indicates X bullets are usually slightly undersized. If fired in anything but a very tight barrel, they can be inaccurate. That is also the source of much of their fouling … if the bullet doesn’t seal the bore, a jet of hot powder gasses work much like an acetylene torch and melt the surface of the bullet, depositing it in the barrel. I can’t blame Barnes much; an undersized bore and an oversized bullet, especially if some moron decided to start with max loads and work up … as some UNSAFE handloaders do … would be a formula for disaster and a lawsuit. My rifle fouled horribly but shot well. ’Course, it shot well with everything; I never tried a bullet in it which wouldn’t break under MOA with a max load of either H4350 or IMR4350, but the X was best by a good margin. Tom Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -# —–Original Message—– # Behalf Of TN65X57 # Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 1998 9:59 AM # # # I have yet to talk to a person who can get a Barnes bullet to group as # well as another bullet in their rifle/pistol! maybe the length compared # to density of lead/lead core. # LB # TN # Well it can be done or you can reduce the group size to very acceptable levels (less than 1 MOA). There are some things you have to remember about the X bullets. 1. They are very sensitive to fouling. The copper of the X bullets is a much softer alloy than the gilding metal jackets of a conventional bullets. Use a copper solvent (Hoppes #9 won’t do it, although the Hoppes Benchrest will) and clean until the patches don’t come out blue or green anymore. 2. As you say they are long for their weight and are harder to stabilize. I guess in that respect I’ve been lucky because my guns shoot them well. 3. All rifles have a preference for certain kinds of ammo. For instance my wife’s 7mm08 shoots the Federal loads with Nosler partitions very well but my Encore won’t. 4. They aren’t Benchrest bullets and will probably never shoot a single hole cloverleaf at 100 yards but what you give up in accuracy you make up in penetration. Alan Minga. The Woodlands, TX NRA Ducks Unlimited "Reloaders truly appreciate a good piece of Brass" TX Coastal Brittany Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
I recently bought some custom handloads in Win. .270 from Superior Ammunition in Sturgis, S.D. - I got a mix of Sierra Game King, Barnes X and Swift A-Frame. The Barnes X and Swift rounds grouped very indifferently through my Win M70 (w/BOSS), shooting worse that over-the-counter Hornady, but the Sierra Game King rounds were fabulous! I put four into 3/4” and three of them went into a clean 1/2” from 100 yds. My take on this is that (in my .270 anyway) the "deep penetration" rounds like Win Failsafe and the Swift and Barnes just don’t shoot as well as faster-opening numbers like the Game King, Hornady, and the Ballistic Silvertip. Maybe it does indeed have to do with length to weight, but for whatever reason, it seems to be a pattern. Best the pup Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
# I have yet to talk to a person who can get a Barnes bullet to group as # well as another bullet in their rifle/pistol! maybe the length compared # to density of lead/lead core. I tried to work up a load with B-X in my .270. I never did get them to group well. Someone in this conference suggested that the X bullets was slightly under size. I checked the bullets I had left and they were much closer to .276 than .277. I have an ‘off the rack’ rifle that is more likley to be bored over size than under size for liability reasons. It made me wonder about the possibility that a sloppy fit between bullet & bore along with a longer bullet may be giving me some wobble factor (highly technical term 8^} ). I have sinced worked up very satisfactory loads with Speer Grand Slam & Nosler Partitions. Just my experience, YMMV d.t. Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
It may be the bullet doesn’t obliverate (sp) properly and therefore does not contact the rifling. Not sure just my humble opinion. Al I have yet to talk to a person who can get a Barnes bullet to group as well as another bullet in their rifle/pistol! maybe the length compared to density of lead/lead core. LB TN You don’t need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
I have yet to talk to a person who can get a Barnes bullet to group as well as another bullet in their rifle/pistol! maybe the length compared to density of lead/lead core. LB TN Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -# —–Original Message—– # Behalf Of Tom Castiglia # Sent: Monday, August 17, 1998 2:10 AM # # # Have any of the reloaders in these groups developed an accurate load for # a .270 Winchester using Barnes 140 gr bullets? # # My rifle won’t do better than 2.5 MOA with this bullet with any # combination of powder or charge weight I feed it. I have also played # with the seating depth. This rifle gives me .75 MOA with Hornady 140 gr # boat tails and .5 MOA with 140 gr. Ballistic tips. Barnes do so well in # my two 7 mms that I’m surprised that the .270 doesn’t like them. # Not with a 270 but I use them in 30-06 and 7mm-08 loads with good sucess. But Your rifle barell has to be spotless to use them. The the XBT’s are pure copper and much softer than a conventional gilding metal jacket. Any kind of crud in the barrell or a rough bore will tear copper away from the bullet and leave it in the barrell. Get some Barnes Copper solvent and follow the directions on the back until patches come out clean. And don’t let the copper solvent sit in the barrell for more than 10 minutes at a time. You could also try an electronic cleaner. Other points to consider The barnes are long for their weight so you have to spin them faster to stabalize them. They might not work in your rifle. Seat the Barnes .050" off the rifling lands. Vhitavouri powder works good with these bullets. Alan Minga. The Woodlands, TX NRA Duck Unlimited "Reloaders truly appreciate a good piece of Brass" TX Youth Hunting Acc. TX Coastal Brittany Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -# —–Original Message—– # Behalf Of Tom Castiglia # Sent: Monday, August 17, 1998 2:10 AM # # # Have any of the reloaders in these groups developed an accurate load for # a .270 Winchester using Barnes 140 gr bullets? # # My rifle won’t do better than 2.5 MOA with this bullet with any # combination of powder or charge weight I feed it. I have also played # with the seating depth. This rifle gives me .75 MOA with Hornady 140 gr # boat tails and .5 MOA with 140 gr. Ballistic tips. Barnes do so well in # my two 7 mms that I’m surprised that the .270 doesn’t like them. # Not with a 270 but I use them in 30-06 and 7mm-08 loads with good sucess. But Your rifle barell has to be spotless to use them. The the XBT’s are pure copper and much softer than a conventional gilding metal jacket. Any kind of crud in the barrell or a rough bore will tear copper away from the bullet and leave it in the barrell. Get some Barnes Copper solvent and follow the directions on the back until patches come out clean. And don’t let the copper solvent sit in the barrell for more than 10 minutes at a time. You could also try an electronic cleaner. Other points to consider The barnes are long for their weight so you have to spin them faster to stabalize them. They might not work in your rifle. Seat the Barnes .050" off the rifling lands. Vhitavouri powder works good with these bullets. Alan Minga. The Woodlands, TX NRA Duck Unlimited "Reloaders truly appreciate a good piece of Brass" TX Youth Hunting Acc. TX Coastal Brittany Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
Have any of the reloaders in these groups developed an accurate load for a .270 Winchester using Barnes 140 gr bullets? My rifle won’t do better than 2.5 MOA with this bullet with any combination of powder or charge weight I feed it. I have also played with the seating depth. This rifle gives me .75 MOA with Hornady 140 gr boat tails and .5 MOA with 140 gr. Ballistic tips. Barnes do so well in my two 7 mms that I’m surprised that the .270 doesn’t like them. I am a little afraid to again use the Hornadys on mule deer after a couple of bad experiences with them (shedding jackets and losing big chunks of bullet mass) a few years ago. Maybe someone knows if something has changed with Hornadys, because it looks like they are the bet as a hunting bullet in my rifle. While I have killed antelope with the Ballistic Tips, my friends have had problems with them on mule deer. Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
