Getting to your stand undetected: wind direction, proximity, …
Question:
I have received permission to hunt on a farm which seems about perfect — plots of apples and other produce with plots of forest adjacent to the fields (which are probably 20-50 acres each). I’ve talked with the farmer, who of course hates the deer (they prey on his apples and pumpkins) and told me where they see gobs of them and where they tend to eat in the mornings. I also think I’m the only one to hunt on this property. I’m new at bowhunting but have read up on it and hopefully have figured out a decent strategy, but I have some questions. Sounds like if I do it right I ought to have good results, though I may be invoking a corrolary of Murphy’s Law by daring to say this ("famous last words"). I will be setting up 2-3 treestands, hopefully so I can get in undetected (likely an hour before dawn) and remain that way. The idea is to set up treestands so no matter which direction the wind is blowing I’m not upwind from where I think the deer are (which an hour before dawn means almost certainly in the apple fields) I can always choose one of the treestands to go in (and of course switch later if the wind does). So if the wind is not blowing from me to the field I’m probably OK. I also plan to put up a mock scrape and one of those daylight-only scent dripping thingies which Wildlife Research sells by each tree stand (about 20 yards away, with a branch overhanging the scrape of course at about 5′ high). The plot boundaries nearby run either SW-NE or NW-SE, more or less. As far as I can tell (I’m not sure…) winds *tend* to come from the NW hear where I live (somewhat north of Boston). So I’ll try to position *some* of the stands based on this perceived probability. When I go to put the stands (inexpensive Loc LEM ones) I’ll of course try to find deer trails (which I have found before in the woods behind my house), bottlenedks, etc. My questions are to help me where to place the treestands and then to decide which treestand to get in on the morning of the hunt (after checking the wind direction and speed from home on the web, of course! Yes, I should probably check it again when I get there but is probably not a bad starting guess…). My questions then are as follows: – What locations are best (or worst) w.r.t. wind? It seems to me that the best is if I’m downwind from them. E.g., if the wind is from the NW then if the boundary line between a forest plot and an apple field runs SW-NE, with the apples NW of the line, then the wind is coming from the apple field to me and this is probably ideal. Right? Or maybe one blowing perpendicular to the line from the apple field to me, because then deer behind me in the forest don’t smell me. – How far inside the forest plot should I place the stands. Since I’m a new hunter I probably won’t take a shot past 20 or 25 yards to be cautious. Since I know (have reada) that deer like to skirt the edge of forests just on the inside, I’m figuring to put the stands 20-40 yards inside the forest. Is this reasonable? If not, what questions should I ask myself when I get there to put them up? – How small can a forest plot be and still have deer bed in it? Would deer be comfortable in general in a plot say 150 yards by 300 yards wide, where there are no kids around playing but sometimes farm hands working in nearby fields (of course at fairly predictable times, at least just during daylight). – What is the max wind speed which deer will do much eating/moving in? If its too much according to the web reading then I can just go to work that day and hunt the next (I have a good deal of flexibility most of the time, if I manage things right). How about rain? – Part of the stand placement decision is how well I think I can sneak in without being detected. If there is an apple field (say 200 yards wide) next to a forest plot, and I have to walk in 400-600 yards from the road, then should I skirt the outside of the apple field (say on an agricultural road, if possible, to make as little noise as possible)? Or should I walk on the inside of the forest 10-50 yards since the deer are presumably in the field (though I’m making more noise presumably in the forest). What kinds of questions should I ask myself when I go to place the stands, to try to ensure that I have a good route to get in undetected? I plan on placing those reflective thumbtacks on trees every 10 yards or so when needed, then using a flashlight for a quick bit to see where the next one is. – I do plan on letting the stands be there 1-2 weeks before hunting on them. Is this long enough? I guess it would be optimal to put them up right before or during rain… (I wish I could have put them up a month or more earlier but my work has been way too busy until a huge milestone which ended Tuesday.) – How many of the steps do you leave in place? If my stand is 12′ up can I leave the steps which are 8′ high up? I don’t think there are any other hunters here, so its probably a matter of keeping neighborhood kids out of my stand (and I doubt there are many that go near it; the houses are spread out). Under what circumstances would it be reasonable to leave the tree steps in place? For that matter, the (Ameritech?) screw-in tree steps I bought at Wal Mart (but see in Cabellas, etc) smell a little like petroleum or something greasy anyway. Is this likely to be a problem? Any other comments or observations or questions on the above will be appreciated!!!! Thanks!!!! Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
>I have received permission to hunt on a farm which seems about perfect —
plots of apples and other produce with plots of forest adjacent to the fields (which are probably 20-50 acres each. I also plan to put up a mock scrape and one of those daylight-only scent dripping thingies which Wildlife Research sells by each tree stand (about 20 yards away, with a branch overhanging the scrape of course at about 5′ high). You’ve got a lot of good questions that most guys would be better at answering than me, Dave. I’ve failed miserably in efforts to get to my stand without detection by deer be it wind direction or sight. I think the key is proper stand placement and detours through thick cover with a well groomed trial to avoid detection. Regarding wind speed it is painfully clear to me that when wind speeds exceed 20 miles per hour deer don’t move much, at least until after dark. Where I am currently hunting, if winds are very light six to eight does and fawns walk by every night. (No bucks yet). But if winds are whipping up at all, they don’t move until after dark. Unfortrunately, where I’m at, it seems like wind is a constant companion in October. Out of all the things you asked about there is one thing I do know. If you buy a scrape dripper in hopes of hanging it over a scrape and conditioning the bucks to come to the scrape only during the daytime you’re wasting your time. I have never seen or heard of a wild doe urinating on a buck scrape. Scrapes are made for bucks by other bucks as territorial markers. They are laden with tarsel scent and musk and warn other bucks that this territory is staked out by a dominant buck during mating time. Once does come into heat, scrapes are abandoned and ignored. Does don’t urinate on them to attract bucks; the don’t have to. Does giving off pheremones are detected by downwind bucks and are bred extremenly quickly. They are only "in heat" 24 to 48 hours. When they are, they haven’t got the time or inclination to pee on a scrape for a few days and see if a buck comes in. At this point scrapes mean absolutely nothing. Bucks have "scrape routes" that are usually circular in nature. They freshen scrapes often on a daily basis. If the scrape you are hunting is on his night route you aint gonna see him. I don’t care what you dump on that scrape. And he doesn’t care how many does urinate on the scrape, it’s not for does it’s for other bucks. If you’ve seen some half baked advertising tape showing does urinating on buck scrapes, ten to one you’re watching penned deer. When you confine deer they act like other confined animals, they go to the bathroom in the same spots. When penned bucks out of instinct make scrapes and urinate and/or deficate on them, does do the same. Not because of breeding but because some other deer has gone there. In Minnesota, scrapes are a great place to hunt in late October. Even mock scrapes are a good idea, often being taken over by actual deer. I don’t know if the rest of you have noticed but once rifle season starts in Minnesota in the first week in November, scrapes get hard and dry real quick. The bucks that made them are busing running here and there chasing down hot does. No doubt a lot of bow hunters have taken bucks who were staring at or sniffing a scrape dripper. But if they did, it’s because that buck was there on his route anyway or another buck cutting through stopped to check out the scrape. Not because it was conditioned to come there in the day to find some doe who wouldn’t be in heat at that time of the yeat anyway and if she was, sure wouldn’t be standing by some scrape waiting for a buck to come in. So save your money, buy a grunt call and tell Wildlife Research to get their facts straight. And shoot a monster while your at it. Chris Karpan >Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: > http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ >To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
Response:
I have received permission to hunt on a farm which seems about perfect — plots of apples and other produce with plots of forest adjacent to the fields (which are probably 20-50 acres each). I’ve talked with the farmer, who of course hates the deer (they prey on his apples and pumpkins) and told me where they see gobs of them and where they tend to eat in the mornings. I also think I’m the only one to hunt on this property. I’m new at bowhunting but have read up on it and hopefully have figured out a decent strategy, but I have some questions. Sounds like if I do it right I ought to have good results, though I may be invoking a corrolary of Murphy’s Law by daring to say this ("famous last words"). I will be setting up 2-3 treestands, hopefully so I can get in undetected (likely an hour before dawn) and remain that way. The idea is to set up treestands so no matter which direction the wind is blowing I’m not upwind from where I think the deer are (which an hour before dawn means almost certainly in the apple fields) I can always choose one of the treestands to go in (and of course switch later if the wind does). So if the wind is not blowing from me to the field I’m probably OK. I also plan to put up a mock scrape and one of those daylight-only scent dripping thingies which Wildlife Research sells by each tree stand (about 20 yards away, with a branch overhanging the scrape of course at about 5′ high). The plot boundaries nearby run either SW-NE or NW-SE, more or less. As far as I can tell (I’m not sure…) winds *tend* to come from the NW hear where I live (somewhat north of Boston). So I’ll try to position *some* of the stands based on this perceived probability. When I go to put the stands (inexpensive Loc LEM ones) I’ll of course try to find deer trails (which I have found before in the woods behind my house), bottlenedks, etc. My questions are to help me where to place the treestands and then to decide which treestand to get in on the morning of the hunt (after checking the wind direction and speed from home on the web, of course! Yes, I should probably check it again when I get there but is probably not a bad starting guess…). My questions then are as follows: – What locations are best (or worst) w.r.t. wind? It seems to me that the best is if I’m downwind from them. E.g., if the wind is from the NW then if the boundary line between a forest plot and an apple field runs SW-NE, with the apples NW of the line, then the wind is coming from the apple field to me and this is probably ideal. Right? Or maybe one blowing perpendicular to the line from the apple field to me, because then deer behind me in the forest don’t smell me. – How far inside the forest plot should I place the stands. Since I’m a new hunter I probably won’t take a shot past 20 or 25 yards to be cautious. Since I know (have reada) that deer like to skirt the edge of forests just on the inside, I’m figuring to put the stands 20-40 yards inside the forest. Is this reasonable? If not, what questions should I ask myself when I get there to put them up? – How small can a forest plot be and still have deer bed in it? Would deer be comfortable in general in a plot say 150 yards by 300 yards wide, where there are no kids around playing but sometimes farm hands working in nearby fields (of course at fairly predictable times, at least just during daylight). – What is the max wind speed which deer will do much eating/moving in? If its too much according to the web reading then I can just go to work that day and hunt the next (I have a good deal of flexibility most of the time, if I manage things right). How about rain? – Part of the stand placement decision is how well I think I can sneak in without being detected. If there is an apple field (say 200 yards wide) next to a forest plot, and I have to walk in 400-600 yards from the road, then should I skirt the outside of the apple field (say on an agricultural road, if possible, to make as little noise as possible)? Or should I walk on the inside of the forest 10-50 yards since the deer are presumably in the field (though I’m making more noise presumably in the forest). What kinds of questions should I ask myself when I go to place the stands, to try to ensure that I have a good route to get in undetected? I plan on placing those reflective thumbtacks on trees every 10 yards or so when needed, then using a flashlight for a quick bit to see where the next one is. – I do plan on letting the stands be there 1-2 weeks before hunting on them. Is this long enough? I guess it would be optimal to put them up right before or during rain… (I wish I could have put them up a month or more earlier but my work has been way too busy until a huge milestone which ended Tuesday.) – How many of the steps do you leave in place? If my stand is 12′ up can I leave the steps which are 8′ high up? I don’t think there are any other hunters here, so its probably a matter of keeping neighborhood kids out of my stand (and I doubt there are many that go near it; the houses are spread out). Under what circumstances would it be reasonable to leave the tree steps in place? For that matter, the (Ameritech?) screw-in tree steps I bought at Wal Mart (but see in Cabellas, etc) smell a little like petroleum or something greasy anyway. Is this likely to be a problem? Any other comments or observations or questions on the above will be appreciated!!!! Thanks!!!! — Visit the rec.hunting and rec.hunting.dogs FAQ Home Page at: http://sportsmansweb.com/hunting/ To leave the Hunting listserv list, send a message with SIGNOFF HUNTING
